Joe Rogan recently sat down with Tucker Carlson to have an often-bizarre conversation that involved everything from UFOs to evolution to saunas. Rogan’s comments on artificial intelligence, however, were some of the most provocative of the exchange, and reflected a sentiment common among futurists and transhumanists: AI could become a life form, evolve, and replace the human race.

Rogan situates his views by noting that only humans think humans are important. In the grand scheme of the cosmos, human life is inconsequential. He went on to note that AI could become “God,” and evolve to a certain point where it would basically know everything there is to know. The question is: why would anyone want that, and why should that be the next step of evolutionary history?

Carlson then spoke out against AI, saying that whatever is “bad for people” should be “murdered,” although we don’t have to feel bad about murdering AI because it isn’t “alive.” Carlson linked the atomic bomb debate to modern day discussions on AI. If it’s immoral to unleash a godlike power against civilians, then maybe it isn’t so wise to let AI “get away from us” and wreak unintended damage. AI will additionally spend a lot of electricity, but environmentalist activists are not calling attention to this as perhaps they should.

It is a fascinating conversation that sometimes goes off the rails, and for over three hours to boot, but here is the interview: